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SubjectRe: [PATCH RFC v5] pidns: introduce syscall translate_pid
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On 05/15/2018 10:36 AM, Konstantin Khlebnikov wrote:
>
>
> On 15.05.2018 20:19, Nagarathnam Muthusamy wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 04/24/2018 10:36 PM, Konstantin Khlebnikov wrote:
>>> On 23.04.2018 20:37, Nagarathnam Muthusamy wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 04/05/2018 12:02 AM, Konstantin Khlebnikov wrote:
>>>>> On 05.04.2018 01:29, Eric W. Biederman wrote:
>>>>>> Nagarathnam Muthusamy <nagarathnam.muthusamy@oracle.com> writes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 04/04/2018 12:11 PM, Konstantin Khlebnikov wrote:
>>>>>>>> Each process have different pids, one for each pid namespace it
>>>>>>>> belongs.
>>>>>>>> When interaction happens within single pid-ns translation isn't
>>>>>>>> required.
>>>>>>>> More complicated scenarios needs special handling.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For example:
>>>>>>>> - reading pid-files or logs written inside container with pid
>>>>>>>> namespace
>>>>>>>> - attaching with ptrace to tasks from different pid namespace
>>>>>>>> - passing pids across pid namespaces in any kind of API
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Currently there are several interfaces that could be used here:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pid namespaces are identified by inode number of
>>>>>>>> /proc/[pid]/ns/pid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Using the inode number in interfaces is not an option. Especially
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> withou referencing the device number for the filesystem as well.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is supposed to be single-instance fs,
>>>>> not part of proc but referenced but its magic "symlinks".
>>>>>
>>>>> Device numbers are not mentioned in "man namespaces".
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pids for nested Pid namespaces are shown in file
>>>>>>>> /proc/[pid]/status.
>>>>>>>> In some cases conversion pid -> vpid could be easily done using
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> information, but backward translation requires scanning all tasks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Unix socket automatically translates pid attached to
>>>>>>>> SCM_CREDENTIALS.
>>>>>>>> This requires CAP_SYS_ADMIN for sending arbitrary pids and
>>>>>>>> entering
>>>>>>>> into pid namespace, this expose process and could be insecure.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This patch adds new syscall for converting pids between pid
>>>>>>>> namespaces:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> pid_t translate_pid(pid_t pid, int source_type, int source,
>>>>>>>>                                  int target_type, int target);
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> @source_type and @target_type defines type of following arguments:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TRANSLATE_PID_CURRENT_PIDNS  - current pid namespace, argument
>>>>>>>> is unused
>>>>>>>> TRANSLATE_PID_TASK_PIDNS     - task pid-ns, argument is task pid
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I believe using pid to represent the namespace has been already
>>>>>>> discussed in V1 of this patch in
>>>>>>> https://lkml.org/lkml/2015/9/22/1087
>>>>>>> after which we moved on to fd based version of this interface.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or in short why is the case of pids important?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You Konstantin you almost said why they were important in your
>>>>>> message
>>>>>> saying you were going to send this one.  However you don't
>>>>>> explain in
>>>>>> your description why you want to identify pid namespaces by pid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Open of /proc/[pid]/ns/pid requires same permissions as ptrace,
>>>>> pid based variant doesn't have such restrictions.
>>>>
>>>> Can you provide more information on usecase requiring PID
>>>> translation but not used for tracing related purposes?
>>>
>>> Any introspection for [nested] containers. It's easier to work when
>>> you have all information when you don't have any.
>>> For example our CMS https://github.com/yandex/porto allows to start
>>> nested sub-container (or even deeper) by request from any container
>>> and have to tell back which pid task is have. And it could translate
>>> any pid inside into accessible by client and vice versa.
>>>
>>
>> I still dont get the exact reason why PID based approach to identify
>> the namespace during pid translation process is absolutely required
>> compared to fd based approach.
>
> As I told open(/proc/%d/ns/pid) have security restrictions - same
> uid/CAP_SYS_PTRACE/whatever
> Pidns-fd holds pid-namespace and without restrictions could be abused.
> Pid based API is racy but always available without any restrictions.
>
>
>> From your version of TranslatePid in
>>
>> https://github.com/yandex/porto/blob/0d7e6e7e1830dcd0038a057b2ab9964cec5b8fab/src/util/unix.cpp
>>
>>
>> I see that you are going through the trouble of forking a process and
>> sending SMC_CREDENTIALS for pid translation. Even your existing API
>> could be extremely simplified if translate_pid based on file
>> descriptors make it to the gate and I believe from the last
>> discussion it was almost there
>> https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/10305439/
>>
>>
>>>> On a side note, can we have the types TRANSLATE_PID_CURRENT_PIDNS
>>>> and TRANSLATE_PID_FD_PIDNS integrated first and then possibly
>>>> extend the interface to include TRANSLATE_PID_TASK_PIDNS in future?
>>>
>>> I don't see reason for this separation.
>>> Pids and pid namespaces are part of the API for a long time.
>>
>> If you are talking about the translate_pid API proposed, I believe
>> the V4 proposed under https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/10003935/
>> had only fd based API before a mix of PID and fd based is proposed in
>> V5. Again, I was just wondering if we can get the FD based approach
>> in first and then extend the API to include PID based approach later
>> as fd based approach could provide a lot of immediate benefits?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Nagarathnam.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Nagarathnam.
>>>>> Most pid-based syscalls are racy in some cases but they are
>>>>> here for decades and everybody knowns how to deal with it.
>>>>> So, I've decided to merge both worlds in one interface which
>>>>> clearly tells what to expect.
>>>>
>>

Ping? Any additional comments on this patch?

Thanks,
Nagarathnam.

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